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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 16:12 
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Onkel Willie wrote:
How about Buddhism then? It's always been quite a tolerant religion. And besides that Christianity and Islam have their good points too even if both have developed in the wrong way. Wouldn't you agree that the Ten Commandments are a good thing?


No I don't think they are all that good. Most of them have little to do with morality and instead have to do with God's insecurity. Then the punishment for breaking any of the laws is stoning to death.
The commandments that actually are relevant to civilization had been known long before the word of mouth tradition's Judeo-Christian-Islamic god.

Whatever good these religions have benefited mankind is mitigated by the potential ill that they keep threatening us with. Evangelical Christians threatens to destroy education through their anti-science propaganda and Islam is a threat against freedom. The word Islam translates to "SUBMIT" so make no mention that they are a religion of liberty.

I would also like to make mention that my statements are facts rather than opinions.

Buddhism is pretty much harmless and atheistic actually. I rather like the concepts of Buddhism but an appeal to emotion does not make truth.

Physical evidence and reasonable logic is how reality is determined.


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 16:46 
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Kurhein wrote:
Onkel Willie wrote:
How about Buddhism then? It's always been quite a tolerant religion. And besides that Christianity and Islam have their good points too even if both have developed in the wrong way. Wouldn't you agree that the Ten Commandments are a good thing?


No I don't think they are all that good. Most of them have little to do with morality and instead have to do with God's insecurity. Then the punishment for breaking any of the laws is stoning to death.
The commandments that actually are relevant to civilization had been known long before the word of mouth tradition's Judeo-Christian-Islamic god.

Whatever good these religions have benefited mankind is mitigated by the potential ill that they keep threatening us with. Evangelical Christians threatens to destroy education through their anti-science propaganda and Islam is a threat against freedom. The word Islam translates to "SUBMIT" so make no mention that they are a religion of liberty.

I would also like to make mention that my statements are facts rather than opinions.

Buddhism is pretty much harmless and atheistic actually. I rather like the concepts of Buddhism but an appeal to emotion does not make truth.

Physical evidence and reasonable logic is how reality is determined.


I agree to your last point. Agree with your comment on the ten commandments, but only when it comes to the first five. Numbers six through ten read: Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour, and lastly Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house,thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.

Wouldn't you agree that those are good things? While morality has evolved in different ways in many places, rules similar to these can be found in just about all religions.

When it comes to Islam, one of the reasons it's radicalized so much is Western imperialism. Islam during the existence of Ottoman Empire was fairly liberal with separate legal statutes for non-Christians that allowed them their own culture and their own justice systems. As a result of the division of the Middle East post-WW I and allowing Jews to take over Palestine, this radicalized into either Arab Nationalism or Islamic Fundamentalism depending on the region. Arab Nationalism pretty much died with Nasser and due to the defeat in the Yom Kippur War, leaving Islamic Fundamentalism as the only anti-ideology available.

Not saying that I agree, but saying that Islam equals to submission is silly. Some Muslim countries like Turkey are highly secular in nature regardless of Muslim origins.

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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 17:13 
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Quote:
Not saying that I agree, but saying that Islam equals to submission is silly. Some Muslim countries like Turkey are highly secular in nature regardless of Muslim origins.

It literally translates as "submission" (to Allah) in particular.


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 17:34 
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Kurhein wrote:
Quote:
Not saying that I agree, but saying that Islam equals to submission is silly. Some Muslim countries like Turkey are highly secular in nature regardless of Muslim origins.

It literally translates as "submission" (to Allah) in particular.


Aren't all the Abrahamic faiths about submitting to one's deity? As far as I'm concerned the three are highly similar.

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"The Superior Man is aware of Righteousness, the inferior man is aware of advantage. The virtuous man is driven by responsibility, the non-virtuous man is driven by profit."


- Confucius

Dutch incel forum: http://onvrijwilligcelibaat.forummaken.nl/

Myths About Atheism: http://www.love-shy.com/lsbb/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16314 For all to see :)


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 17:55 
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Onkel Willie wrote:
Kurhein wrote:
Quote:
Not saying that I agree, but saying that Islam equals to submission is silly. Some Muslim countries like Turkey are highly secular in nature regardless of Muslim origins.

It literally translates as "submission" (to Allah) in particular.


Aren't all the Abrahamic faiths about submitting to one's deity? As far as I'm concerned the three are highly similar.


They are interpretations of the same God's will.

Every religion claims that it is the one truth. They can't all be correct BUT they can all be wrong. Applying Occam's Razor would suggest the logical answer be the latter.


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 18:13 
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Kurhein wrote:
Onkel Willie wrote:
Kurhein wrote:
Quote:
Not saying that I agree, but saying that Islam equals to submission is silly. Some Muslim countries like Turkey are highly secular in nature regardless of Muslim origins.

It literally translates as "submission" (to Allah) in particular.


Aren't all the Abrahamic faiths about submitting to one's deity? As far as I'm concerned the three are highly similar.


They are interpretations of the same God's will.

Every religion claims that it is the one truth. They can't all be correct BUT they can all be wrong. Applying Occam's Razor would suggest the logical answer be the latter.


Yes, I know that. The most likely explanation for lack of evidence for God is that he doesn't exist. And I myself believe this too, I am an atheist. I'm just saying that some elements of religion are good as well, such as for example religious charities like the Salvation Army. The fact that religion is used for bad is because humans are imperfect beings and twist religion to suit their own needs.

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"Give me a woman who truly loves beer, and I will conquer the world!"

- Emperor Wilhelm II

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"The Superior Man is aware of Righteousness, the inferior man is aware of advantage. The virtuous man is driven by responsibility, the non-virtuous man is driven by profit."


- Confucius

Dutch incel forum: http://onvrijwilligcelibaat.forummaken.nl/

Myths About Atheism: http://www.love-shy.com/lsbb/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16314 For all to see :)


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 18:29 
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Onkel Willie wrote:
Yes, I know that. The most likely explanation for lack of evidence for God is that he doesn't exist. And I myself believe this too, I am an atheist. I'm just saying that some elements of religion are good as well, such as for example religious charities like the Salvation Army. The fact that religion is used for bad is because humans are imperfect beings and twist religion to suit their own needs.



Religion was invented to suit the needs of men.


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 18:33 
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Kurhein wrote:
Onkel Willie wrote:
Yes, I know that. The most likely explanation for lack of evidence for God is that he doesn't exist. And I myself believe this too, I am an atheist. I'm just saying that some elements of religion are good as well, such as for example religious charities like the Salvation Army. The fact that religion is used for bad is because humans are imperfect beings and twist religion to suit their own needs.



Religion was invented to suit the needs of men.


so?

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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 18:50 
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darwin wrote:

so?


The fact that it is an invention of man refutes the validity of "divine" origin.


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 18:56 
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Kurhein wrote:
darwin wrote:

so?


The fact that it is an invention of man refutes the validity of "divine" origin.


sadly not... since divine inspiration can never be disproven either...

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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 19:02 
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darwin wrote:
Kurhein wrote:
darwin wrote:

so?


The fact that it is an invention of man refutes the validity of "divine" origin.


sadly not... since divine inspiration can never be disproven either...



If it can't be proven then it's invalid. It's called burden of proof and the believers fail to provide it.


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 19:11 
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Kurhein wrote:
darwin wrote:
Kurhein wrote:
darwin wrote:

so?


The fact that it is an invention of man refutes the validity of "divine" origin.


sadly not... since divine inspiration can never be disproven either...



If it can't be proven then it's invalid. It's called burden of proof and the believers fail to provide it.


the burden of proof doesn't apply... the apparatus to create the proof itself doesn't exist... its divine inspiration!

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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 19:20 
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darwin wrote:
Kurhein wrote:
darwin wrote:
Kurhein wrote:
darwin wrote:

so?


The fact that it is an invention of man refutes the validity of "divine" origin.


sadly not... since divine inspiration can never be disproven either...



If it can't be proven then it's invalid. It's called burden of proof and the believers fail to provide it.


the burden of proof doesn't apply... the apparatus to create the proof itself doesn't exist... its divine inspiration!


Then I have no means to tell weather the "divinely inspired" is speaking truth or deluded ranting.


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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 19:27 
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Kurhein wrote:
Then I have no means to tell weather the "divinely inspired" is speaking truth or deluded ranting.


and?

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 Post subject: Re: Does God Exist?
PostPosted: 15 May 2012, 19:36 
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Then you apply the logical answer that would be the man is deluded. If you wonder where all the modern day prophets are they're in an asylum or on tv. (P.S. The ones on tv do it for the money.)


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