well, there are some asexuals/borderline asexuals who would actually be ok with just cuddling here.
but I know what you mean, I've been there
it was frustrating, because she refused to decide if we were friends or something more, but would keep coming and lying next to me. so it ended up cuddles without any clear boundaries. and it wasn't nearly as good as it would have been with a girlfriend, because there wasn't an implied intimate connection to share. you couldn't look into her eyes and know that she was yours (in a manner of speaking). I guess I felt a little used, too, because she was in control. Her ambiguity and lack of straight honesty meant she determined how everything would play out, at any given time. I was just lead along like on a collar.

Those guys should have dumped you from the moment they knew what was going on.

So its cool you are with a loveshy guy now but some of the men you treated this way might have been decent men also so what you did was not really a nice thing to do.

Mitchell:

What are you talking about??

I didn't do anything wrong to them. I gave them pleasure whenever they wanted, and not to toot my own horn, but I'm pretty damn good at what I do, AND they didn't even have to do a lick of work to get me off EVER. Some of those guys told me I gave them the best orgasms they'd ever had.

It was a sweet deal for them, so I don't get what you're driving at. These "decent men" had no qualms. One of them DID dump me, because he was a Catholic, and decided I was lying about my virginity because according to him virgins shouldn't know how to do the things I did to get him off.

I was what you guys call "volcel" so I was the one frustrated most of the time. They WEREN'T complaining, so why the fuck should you?

Methinks you didn't read my posts fully, sweetheart.

it doesn't sound right to me to be in a relationship with someone who doesn't have genuine feelings for you, I think that's what he's getting at. But it was their choice, so long as you made it clear to them.

This is what i ment to say more or less.

I don't get you at all.



How can you consider yourself a virgin, when giving men blowjobs?



Yes it was



Maybee you get a kick of that power? Are you getting a kick of writing the above on a forum like this, You tortured the men, and the description abowe is torture to someone who hasn't had that.



This is so insensetive of you, I understand why the guys react.



But as you describe it, it seams that you enjoyed it though


Yes you should because you used them, as you use your Love-shy man.
People who are hurt are sensitive to lack of emotional integrity, are you sure he wants you to tell others about him.



You take for granted that plesure is the only thing a guy want in a relationship.
I don't think that getting pleased by a woman who sees it as a job, is top ranked in most mens mind. A bit more regular and moore cheap than going to a whore.
But that is surely not what men want, if their not disturbed that is

Maybe it was mutual usage of one another, but if it where they would be called friends with benefits, not boyfriends.
Why don't you believe that a man could long for closeness and intimacy and feel deprivated even if he isn't open about it?

I don't get you

I thought it was clear that Mirror regretted the stuff she did - even if not as much as would be required for a "perfect" moral posture.

Her comments here show that she's still under some influence from lamestream thinking: her ideas of male behavior and sexuality were rather narrow before she met her current man, which is understandable given all the stereotypes and misinformation that get thrown around almost everywhere. Think about it: she's a girl, and she hasn't had any trouble finding an unspecified number of boyfriends despite her clearly unorthodox beliefs; she most likely came from a slice of reality where men like us are not just ignored, but invisible! Think of what it must be like for her now that she's with an LS man, and now that she's stepping into this forum. Must be eye-opening, right? This forum is probably giving her a unique look into the existence, the variety, and most importantly, the value, of men like us.

We get "outsiders" all the time, of course... But personally, I'd rather save my energies for PC-obsessed conformists.

Mirror and The_woman, take a look at this poll and the ensuing thread; it goes to show that just because a guy is... a guy, doesn't mean he absolutely needs sex in his relationship.

That being said; yeah, Mirror, I haven't been in the "blue balls" situation (I did sleep with my girlfriend for 4 years with no sex stuff going on, but it was bliss, not torture). You're probably right in that a lot of men, maybe most, wouldn't take kindly to such an arrangement, and I can't speak for them. But usually people have a rough idea of how much they need sex/love, especially as they get older, and they don't necessarily have to have experienced it. Some people need to learn from experience, others can get by with introspection alone. Openness/communication, however, is perhaps a must, to avoid situations like Fonduman's.

Whoah whoah whoah...

Why is everyone saying I tortured these men? I didn't do anything to them. I wanted them to be sexually satisfied, even if I wasn't ready to have sex with them. What's wrong with that?

I don't understand why everyone's getting so pissed.

How does any of that mean LS men were invisible to me? I'm confused here as to why I'm in the hot seat for giving my boyfriends some sort of sexual relief. They WANTED me to.

Interesting how everyone here is all of the sudden against me because I didn't want to be a tease.

would you want to be in a relationship with someone who just gave you occasional "sexual relief" to keep you happy, whilst not desiring closeness themselves? I'd feel terrible.

Yes, I would want that person to CHOSE to have full sex with me WHEN THEY FEEL READY, NOT JUST BECAUSE I WAS HORNY.


I wasn't ready to go all the way, but I was willing to compromise because I was still in love.

You guys sound pretty self-contradictory here. One the one hand, you call me a whore because I allowed myself to do sexual things. But then you berate me for not spreading my legs when I wasn't ready.

Do I have to repeat, THEY WANTED ME TO DO IT?

I'm a whore because I didn't have full sex with them?

And as for The_Woman...Yeah, I'm of the opinion that a person is still a virgin even if they had a penis in their mouths. So what of it?

Since when is everyone so against sexuality? Is sexuality considered "sin" in here?

Why are you reacting so defensively and blowing things out or proportion (such as claiming we said sexuality was a sin)? Relax.


I didn't say they were invisible to you. They are invisible to mainstream society, from which we all come from before we start opening our eyes to diversity. When a guy doesn't show interest in girls or doesn't reciprocate romantic interest, he can be assumed to be any number of things from gay to closeted pervert to commitment-phobic. Shyness is often the last thing on people's minds. Plus, a lot of guys develop LS along with a series of traits that make them loners or outcasts, thus invisible.

Well, The_Woman called me a whore, because I gave my exes blow jobs.

Sorry, but being called a whore puts me on the defensive. She also accused me of torturing men, and enjoying it because I used humor to describe how crappy it would be IF I WAS a tease, which I wasn't because I gave them pleasure. Hence her calling me a whore (WTF?), when in truth I think she's just pissed because I'm another chick (female rivalry? ).

This is nice. I'm on here, trying to help folks and I get berated for being possible asexual in my early years.

To The_Woman, them's fighting words, honey. What'd I ever do to you?




I get what you're saying about LS being invisible in society. If people would be more understanding, I think LS might even cease to exist. My exes weren't LS. One was a model. Another was a bisexual musician. My ex fiance was a hipster pretty boy who thought the world owed him because he looked a little like Johnny Depp. (And don't get on me for dating these guys, people. They were the ones who approached me, and considering my profession, those are the kinds of circles I run in.)

You guys are victimizing them with out realizing that these fellas WERE NOT LS. They got laid more than what's good for them.

And you also seem to think I didn't have feelings for them. I was in love with my BFs. They weren't like the guy from my dream (which I didn't even know if he would be real or not.), but I still fell in love with them at the time anyway.

I wanted their closeness, the intimacy, but I just didn't desire sex with them because I wasn't sure yet. How come it's ok for asexuals on here to make these claims, but when I say it, I'm bad?

I suppose it's a case that, everyone here was naturally putting themselves in the shoes of these guys, and then being offended because it doesn't seem right from our perspective. Most LS guys here probably hope for a full experience with regard to being in a relationship (and like you said, the guys you were with weren't even LS I think, so that's one thing already). I think I can appreciate your point of view, because the thing is based on it being a mutual agreement and consenting. Right? ;o

Though sure, from the outside, it might seem like a strange situation to purposefully set up. We just assumed that being a guy in that situation, and not being welcome to the full experience probably feels like they are being unjustly denied it or something. So, we're all "Gosh..!" I guess the argument is, if you didn't want to offer that particular aspect to them, why even get into a relationship in the first place. But then, as I said, this rolls all the way back round to the idea of it being a mutual understanding between you and the guys, and also enters the realm of asexual relationships I guess - which you've already touched on in a new thread. So not much more to say. ;o I think in the end, if it was a mutual agreement, you weren't purposefully deceiving them, and it was all fine and dandy. From a third person's perspective, I think initially it just seems strange.

Right, everything kosher now?

No I didn't. You yourself called your behavior whorish,and you described it, like a job. (look at the exact quote above)
And from that description I agreed.
To do something one doesn't really want to do Is simply not good for you.

I don't judge your behavior, my reactions are mere based on how you're bantering about it.


This describes a powerlesss man.

No it hurts

This hurts in another way. This is rejection

Combined it looks like torture to me.

No that is what you have read in to them. The only one fighting and accusing is you.

Again I don't criticize your actions as much as your reasoning. As I said I don't get you. Maybe I used the English language wrong? What i meant is that I don't understand your reasoning. Maybe I totally misunderstand you, my reactions are based on how you describe things.

You say you want to help, how?